How is Asheville Police Department using drones? Officials ask for transparency

ASHEVILLE — City Council members put pointed questions to Asheville Police Department administration on their use of drones in a Jan. 23 meeting of the Environment and Safety Committee, highlighting the need for more public transparency.

APD announced its joint Drone Unit with Asheville Fire Department in June 2023, but disclosed during this month’s safety meeting that police received and deployed the first drones in October 2022.

In June both APD and AFD had one drone each. Now, the Drone Unit has a total of 10 drones, nine of which are at the police’s disposal, according to APD spokesperson Samantha Booth.

“There’s a lot of people who are just very concerned about this technology,” said City Council member Maggie Ullman, who is also chair of the safety committee. "(Transparency) seems like the essential ingredient for programs like this to really thrive in communities with community support."

Ullman asked if the department’s policy on drone use could be made public.

"That policy, since it was published, has been available along with all the other APD policies, so it is readily available and it can be seen and viewed," Capt. Brandon Moore replied.

Previous coverage: Asheville police, fire departments launch 'cutting edge' drone unit

However, a public commenter at the end of the meeting, 16-year Asheville resident Patrick Conant, stated that the policy was uploaded to APD’s website while the Jan. 23 meeting was happening.

Conant later told the Citizen Times he emailed Ullman during the meeting, saying that he didn’t see the drone policy listed among APD’s other policies. A few minutes later, Ullman asked where it can be found.

“I refreshed the page, and all of a sudden it appeared,” Conant said. “I’m glad that the policy is online now, but I think it’s important for (City) Council and the public to understand that policy hasn’t been easily accessible until yesterday.”

Booth confirmed with the Citizen Times Jan. 24 that the policy was uploaded to the department’s website on Jan. 23 but said any member of the public could request the policy through the city’s public records request portal.

The Citizen Times first requested the drone policy on Dec. 19, which was uploaded to the request portal and viewable to any member of the public on Jan. 3.

“I think the public needs a lot more information on how drones are utilized by APD and the fire department and specifically, for what kinds of issues do they deploy drones and why?” Conant said. “Community members and elected officials need to have a say in the policies that govern their use.”

APD's Moore gave an example of when a drone was deployed in response to a call of someone wielding a knife downtown and was able to determine that the weapon was actually a stick. This changed the level of response APD had to the situation, he said.

Ullman also asked if they could find a way for community members to ask more questions and raise concerns they have directly with APD on how they are interpreting their written drone policy.

“We would be happy to sit down and try to answer some of those concerns,” Moore said. “I don’t think we have, from the start, ever tried to hide anything we are doing with the program.”

“No public safety agency needs to be worried about hiding what they are doing, they just need to be able to show how it has benefitted the community, and that’s where that support comes from.”

Drone capabilities: facial recognition? Break glass?

During the meeting, council members questioned APD officials on concerns they’ve received from the public regarding the capabilities and use of their drones. Specifically, Ullman asked if the drones could open doors or break windows.

“We don’t specifically have an aircraft that is designed to do what you just described, and we wouldn’t utilize it for that purpose,” Moore said. “There is one drone currently on the market that is marketed as having the ability to break glass. We researched the use of that … and did not find it as what we wanted to deploy.”

Ullman also asked if these drones have facial recognition, or AI, technology, similar to the FUSUS technology’s capabilities that the Buncombe County Sheriff’s Office and APD has but stated they do not use.

More: Buncombe County Sheriff has 1,800-camera network; Asheville PD now gets to use it

More: Buncombe County Sheriff gets real-time Fusus bodycams, dashcams: Who can access?

“It’s been pretty well documented that facial recognition software has some major flaws when looking at diversity of melanin in skin and there’s been some correlation to racial profiling with facial recognition software,” Ullman said, asking if the drones are using any smart technology to do any kind of facial recognition.

"The camera capability on this technology is incredible and we will see that increase moving forward. We do not use an AI-based technology within that camera to track and/or follow someone based on what you’re describing," Moore replied.

He said there are smart features to track people, cars or areas, but it’s not based in AI.

“AI has its limitations; it has caused issues. That is not something we employ,” Moore said. “An individual behind the drone will be determining if that’s the person, not the computer itself.”

Was the drone you saw APD's? Transparency dashboard in the works

The Citizen Times has received reports from readers of drones hovering over downtown, some even worried that the drones were following them or taking footage of them.

"I think that's the importance of having the dashboard so that if somebody is thinking 'Hey, is that APD drone watching me?' they can get on the dashboard and see if it was an APD drone or if it was a privately owned drone," APD Interim Chief Michael Lamb told the Citizen Times Jan. 24.

He added that APD sometimes launches drones from their downtown station on training flights for officers to complete training hours required by the Federal Aviation Administration.

APD is working on a transparency page to provide public data on drone flights, including calls type of aircraft, duration of flight, and comprehensive flight data, including altitude, AUV speed, direction of travel, according to Moore.

“APD has just signed a contract with the management company,” Moore told the Citizen Times by email. “We're actively working to get everything established as soon as possible.”

Moore also noted that footage from the drones will be automatically uploaded to evidence.com, where all body camera and dash camera footage is placed. Similar to these other types of police footage, drone video will not be publicly accessible.

Can drones be used to look into buildings?

The department's policy states that drones will not be used to “intentionally look into structures,” unless a search warrant authorizes it as part of a law enforcement investigation. But Lamb added an addendum to that.

“If there’s a place where there’s a danger, an active danger to themselves or to others, then the search warrant wouldn’t apply as that event is unfolding,” Lamb told the Citizen Times Jan 24.

“Search warrants take time to research, apply for and then get granted. If we are able to save somebody’s life during that time period, we are going to deploy the drone and use it, but that’s only under exigent circumstances.”

Lamb cited the Dec. 20 active shooter situation at the Buncombe County Health and Human Services building on Coxe Avenue, hostage situations, the sound of a gunshot or talk about hurting somebody as examples of when a warrant would not be needed for a drone to peer inside a building, stipulating that it’s “any where somebody’s life is at risk.”

Lamb spoke to the Citizen Times about an incident in 2018, where he suffered multiple contusions to his head and multiple cuts along his arms from a man who came at him with a box cutter. He had gone to a man’s back window to see what type of weapon the man had and admits that he “got too close.”

The man then lunged at Lamb, who then had to use "deadly force" to shoot the suspect, who he said was in a state of drug psychosis and actively slashing him with a knife. The man lived and was taken into custody, but the interim chief used this as an example of when drones could be a helpful protection measure.

“If we had a drone, we could have flown a drone to the back window and looked inside and seen that yes, he did have a weapon and we needed back up,” Lamb said in December. “So, if we can put a drone in that situation and save not only an officer’s life, but a suspects life, I think it’s worth it.”

The drones also have infrared capabilities, Booth confirmed, but that technology can only be used in situations similar to when drones are allowed to look into windows.

“The drones APD deploys are equipped with infrared cameras that are capable of capturing both short wave and long wave infrared radiation,” Booth said over email. “In situations involving extenuating circumstances, such as locating a missing person, this technology may be utilized.”

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How much does each drone cost?

The Citizen Times’ public records request for the total amount spent on drones and their accessories since the first one was purchased in 2022 was not fulfilled before press time.

However, obtained invoices and purchase orders highlight some of the money allocated to this new ariel technology.

One invoice billed to APD for two drones in October 2022, including a thermal and laser rangefinder, batteries and accessories, cost the department $43,300.

A purchase order, dated March 30, 2023, priced one drone with its accessories at $9,341. Another order on Feb. 22, 2023, totaled $21,650 for one drone, its accessories and a full system set up.

Money allocated to drone software: Drone software, new equipment for Asheville Police Department approved by City Council

Can members of the public see drone footage?

Drone footage falls under the same guidelines as videos from police body cameras or vehicle dashboard cameras in N.C. General Statue 132-1.4A. Meaning, anyone whose voice or image is captured in the footage may go to the police station, submit a written request, and view it.

In the written request, potential viewers must state the date or approximate time the activity was recorded, and “the law enforcement agency shall disclose only those portions of the recording that are relevant to the person's request.”

“If that person is captured within that footage … they make an appointment with professional standards and then come in and watch it from there,” Lamb said.

Per the state statute, a law enforcement agency may decide not to show the footage to the requester only under certain circumstances, including if it may jeopardize an open internal or criminal investigation or may harm someone’s reputation or safety.

Want to know more?

To view APD's policies, including their use of drones, visit public.powerdms.com/ASHV/list/documents/2646836.

To view the N.C. General Statute on bodycam and dashcam footage go to ncleg.gov/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/PDF/BySection/Chapter_132/GS_132-1.5.pdf

Ryley Ober is the Public Safety Reporter for Asheville Citizen Times, part of the USA Today Network. Email her at [email protected] and follow her on Twitter @ryleyober

This article originally appeared on Asheville Citizen Times: How is Asheville Police Department using drones?